We’ve all heard the term prejudice — to judge before knowing. But what about post-judice — when our biases form after personal pain or experiences? In this conversation, Pastors Jim Eaton and Rod Hairston explore how trauma, repeated narratives, and lived experiences can shape the way we see others, and how faith, healing, and empathy can help us break free.
They discuss:
- The difference between prejudice and post-judice
- How trauma imprints bias on our hearts and minds
- The role of empathy, spiritual maturity, and post-traumatic growth
- How God uses pain for healing and redemption
Be encouraged: God can use even your pain for His glory and your growth.
“Heal me, O Lord, and I will be healed.” — Jeremiah 17:14
Transcript
Jim Eaton: So what we’d like to do this time is talk about something that I really think is not talked about enough when it comes to the culture, diversity, all these issues. And the way I like to think of it is, you know, we all know what prejudice is, right? From the Latin pre and judiciary, to judge beforehand. But what if we created a word and called it postjudice. So like post and then judice, like after. Like postpartum depression, after the baby comes, or post office, the letter comes after it should. But, so if we’d say this, we’d say, okay, what if there are times where people form opinions, they form impressions, not before the event, not because someone taught them that, but because they went through an experience personally. And then, maybe a week later or a month later, they were around people like that and they went through an experience similar. And over time they’ll go, “I’m not sure I wanna go through those kinds of experiences again. And they seem to happen to me more with this group than with this group.” And I really think this is something we need to talk about.
Rod Hairston: Man, you’re onto something because it’s not only experiences, as you’re defining this term, postjudice. I love, I love it, I love the thought leadership here. What you’re also describing is what happens when judgments are passed down, right? So that through teaching around our tables, conversation in our homes about people groups, about experiences, and that you see this upon the news, you know, down there in that part of town.
Jim: That’s right.
Rod: Right. Or those people. And so our children can begin to learn, right, postjudice, right, because…
Jim: Like, what happens, let’s say a black pastor boards an airplane and he’s going to his assigned seat and there’s a white woman seated next to where he’s going to sit down, and as he sits down, she clutches her purse.
Rod: Right.
Jim: How does he feel? He may not go into these situations with a preformed opinion, but that impression, that experience hurts him, okay? And who knows, but maybe that white woman has experiences of her own that are causing her to react a certain way. So I think that, I don’t think it’s one or the other, I think it’s both. I think there’s some interaction, interplay here. But I do believe that if we can start to address the issues where people experience personal pain, personal trauma, and instead of putting everything in the category of, well, you need to correct your prejudice, you need to be educated, there certainly is a place for that. But I think, for example, the immense traumas in the Middle East right now, and if you’re talking to an Israeli man, and what if he was meeting his fiancee at the bus stop, and as she gets ready to leave the bus to meet him, a suicide bomber blows up the bus and his fiance is killed? And now you want to try to help the Israeli to have a greater sensitivity toward Palestinians, you have to work through his trauma. It’s more than just a seminar.
Rod: Yeah. There’s no easy button on it. There’s no easy button on it. And I would say, in addition to the experiences, oftentimes people experience the narratives.
Jim: Ah, that’s good.
Rod: Repeatedly. Right?
Jim: That’s good.
Rod: And so that can form the same kind of postjudice. So I think you’re right, Jim. I know you’re right. It’s not an easy work through, but it’s a very real challenge. Because if it’s trauma, if it’s imprinted on our brains long enough that something is real, that’s really the power of media.
Jim: Yeah.
Rod: Right? The power of media is that it imprints on our brains. And the more you see the story, the more you hear the story.
Jim: That’s such a good point. That’s such a good point.
Rod: It’s what happens in America, it’s what’s happened in our nation, probably more prominently in the last 20 years than at any other time, right? Biases of media that keep telling the same story. So if you keep hearing somebody say something enough times, then that will imprint on the brain, probably in a similar way as a traumatic experience will. Because what trauma does is it imprints a memory on the brain and within our emotional infrastructure, so that we begin to believe that this is the way it always is. And especially, when it’s related to another people group, another race of people, then we develop this conclusion, I think, a conclusion, that these people could be problematic for me.
Jim: That’s right. And I think, you know, the Word of God really does speak to this. Because if all we do is address with people the challenges of prejudice, that is one set of things, you know? You haven’t heard the whole history of our country. There’s another story that has been suppressed and needs to come out, and now you see more of what was really happening all along. The educational feature is so prominent, so strong, and God talks to us about, “If you know the truth, the truth will set you free.” But the Word also has so much to say about how the Spirit of God can miraculously heal us, and that we can come before Him and say “As the words that heal me, O Lord, and I will be healed.” And sometimes, you really have to come to God and say, “I don’t know what to do with this pain. I don’t know what to do with this fear. I don’t wanna go back into that again, but I know I live in a world of imperfect people, and I don’t want to be cocooned off in some kind of place where I’m afraid to even live my life.” What if God wants to do something through your life and it involves some of the pain he’s allowed you to go through? I mean, we have so many stories, don’t we? People who’ve really done something for the kingdom, and you look at their lives and it comes out of a place of great pain.
Rod: Well, who knows that experience of not letting those biases hinder Him more than the Apostle Paul? I mean, there there was…
Jim: That’s so true.
Rod: There seems hardly a day where He was not opposed,
Jim: Yeah.
Rod: Right? Jeremiah knows it. Jeremiah goes through the beatings, right. So he could ,any of these people, right? This is a common theme –
Jim: Oh, yeah.
Rod: in scripture, right? “Those who desire to live godly will be persecuted.”
Jim: That’s right.
Rod: But the idea that we’re talking about here is when you had a traumatic experience, whether you will allow it to dictate to you a bias toward people. I think we gotta be really intentional about our own spiritual maturity.
Jim: I do too.
Rod: To not let these biases form, these prejudices, or postjudices, form, and take root in our lives. So here’s my question, Jim, since you raised this question, what do you do?
Jim: That is such a great question. And people are writing books on this because it’s so real. I mean, on the one hand, we need to have the courage to face these things. I mean, Job’s friends came to him and they sat for three days and said nothing. I think there are times where we are too quick to talk to people. Like, “Let me just give you a Bible verse and you’ll be fine.” You know? And what people need is for us to sit with them, how much we talk amongst ourselves and then what we’re doing here about empathy, to know someone truly empathizes with your particular story and your pain, is huge. But then there’s also this aspect where God moves through that. Like, I think of Joseph and all his brothers did to him, and when they come to him, he arranges some tests. He doesn’t just go, “Oh, it’s all good.” No, no, he arranges tests to see where are my brother’s hearts now? And it’s when Judah stands up says, “Take my life and set my brother free,” that Joseph breaks down and weeps because now he knows his brother’s hearts have changed. And when they come to him in fear, he says, “You meant this for evil in my life, but God meant it for good, for the saving of many people.” And I think there’s a way we need to have a spirit-filled balance of empathy and courage to know that yes, people go through incredible pain and you don’t minimize that, you weep with people, you empathize. But neither do we become people of no hope, because God can pick us up and He can heal us, and then use us, sometimes, among the very people who’ve hurt us.
Rod: Wow! You know, in therapeutic counseling and coaching circles we call it post-traumatic growth. So often, there’s an emphasis when there’s been a traumatic experience, the emphasis is on the trauma and what it did to you, the negative experience itself, but there’s a whole growing conversation –
Jim: That’s right.
Rod: about the growth that can happen, right? I love what you quoted, “They may have meant it for evil, but God meant it for good.” “God calls us all things to work for the good of those who love Him, are called according to His purpose.” And either we believe it’s all, or we don’t, right? We believe that God can use those experiences, or we don’t. So it’s really, what I hear you say is we’re all faced with making a very crucial choice decision that God is able to heal from my wounds and trauma, and I’m able to, by the grace of God, love people who didn’t love me.
Jim: Amen. Amen.
Rod: Who did that better than Jesus?
Jim: So true.
Rod: “Father, forgive them. They don’t know what they do.”
Jim: Yeah. So we just wanna give you some hope today. If you’ve been through pain, if you’ve been through hardship, Jesus understands your pain, He’s walking with you. And brothers and sisters in Christ, we’re walking together. But take courage and take hope that God can do something miraculous, even through your pain, to do something for His glory and for your blessing.
Rod: Yeah, and I would add, don’t let a painful experience cause you to live in misery.
Jim: Amen.
Rod: And bitterness and hatred and anger. Because none of those will serve you in the long run.
Jim: That’s right.
Rod: Spiritually, physically, and relationally, or any other way.
Jim: Amen.